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Received your new redesigned R51 yet?

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.410
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 30, 2016 11:15 am
No, what you need to do is post some pictures! Lol
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 30, 2016 8:11 pm
You can see videos of the new R51 gen 2 by "ryeonham". He says he will have a range video up tomorrow or Saturday. He didn't seem real impressed with his trigger and I got the feeling by some of his comments his range visit wasn't as smooth either.

Still waiting for mine to arrive.
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 30, 2016 11:07 pm
My 2nd Generation R51 arrived today. I'll get it to the range next week, but here are some initial observations.

As promised, the gun comes with the 2 standard magazines, 2 extra mags and a Pelican hardcase. The mags are the first differnces I noted.

MAGAZINES
1G: Thin, flat floor plate that fits flush to the butt.
2G: Thicker, rounded floor plate that extends slightly past the butt for more sure seating of mag.

1G: Flat follower
2G: Follower has a raised center ridge rising from a point 3/8s from the rear

2G: Slightly wider front lip tab. Less likely to catch in hollow point cavity.

THE GUN

Model logo on right side moved from frame to slide, just behind ejection port.

Trigger has less side play than my 1G but still has some. Has a definite reset, but will likely still draw criticism because there is a false reset feel just before the actual reset. Trigger weight remains the same 3.5-4lbs.

Rear sight has a set screw to lock it in place and prevent drift during firing.

Breechblock is more cleanly finished, looks like a machined piece rather than a finished casting.

Frame locking lug is still aluminum, but is more precisely machined and hardened.

I did not disassemble the firecontrol, but the disconnector feels much smoother in tis vertical travel leading to less resistance and less "chatter" when racking the slide.

Overall, it just has a higher quality feel. I'm sure others may note more differences, as I seem to have one of the few 1G R51s that was actually fully functional. My major complaints were the "pimpled" primers and tight chamber which prevented some brands of ammo from fully chambering without deeply engraving on the lands. A quick plunk test showed that the chamber is still tight, though not as tight as my 1G. American Eagle 115g FMJ which engraved in my 1G seat fully without engraving in my 2G, but 122g Lead conical (MBC 9Cone) seated as max OAL will not chamber without deeply engraving. They seat fine in my Browning HighPower for which they were initially loaded.

Mine came with a packing manifest listing my original R51 1G with serial number and my 2G R51 with serial number shipped as a replacement I suppose this can serve as proof of ownership if needed.

No info on how to get reimbursed for Xfer fee, so I guess I'll have to call about that.
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 01, 2016 7:27 pm
Let us know what you learn about reimbursement of transfer fees.
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 04, 2016 6:39 pm
Oh Joy! I just found a new problem with my Gen2 I did not have with the Gen1.

With the slide locked back on an empty mag, pulling the trigger will release the hammer so that when the slide is released, it hangs on the uncocked hammer. This requires racking the slide again to cock the hammer. However, the slide will have moved far enough to start to feed the new round so it will appear to be a failure to feed as the round will be partially up the feed ramp. Looks very much like a classic 3-point.

Obviously the newly designed disconnector is not disconnecting when the slide is locked back. If this newly designed part is the one that was holding up release until it was "extensively tested", it apparently wasn't extensively tested enough. OTOH, this could be a one-off problem that only I have.

This is a potentially serious matter on a SD gun as you are very likely to pull the trigger on a locked slide.

I still plan on going to the range tomorrow but I will then probably be calling Remington and asking if I can still trade for an R1. or get a refund. I'm not interested in waiting another 2 years. :x
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 04, 2016 11:36 pm
JRH6856 wrote:Oh Joy! I just found a new problem with my Gen2 I did not have with the Gen1.

With the slide locked back on an empty mag, pulling the trigger will release the hammer so that when the slide is released, it hangs on the uncocked hammer. This requires racking the slide again to cock the hammer. However, the slide will have moved far enough to start to feed the new round so it will appear to be a failure to feed as the round will be partially up the feed ramp. Looks very much like a classic 3-point.

Obviously the newly designed disconnector is not disconnecting when the slide is locked back. If this newly designed part is the one that was holding up release until it was "extensively tested", it apparently wasn't extensively tested enough. OTOH, this could be a one-off problem that only I have.

This is a potentially serious matter on a SD gun as you are very likely to pull the trigger on a locked slide.

I still plan on going to the range tomorrow but I will then probably be calling Remington and asking if I can still trade for an R1. or get a refund. I'm not interested in waiting another 2 years. :x

Did you slingshot the slide or drop it?
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 05, 2016 7:54 am
AmericanPride wrote:Did you slingshot the slide or drop it?


Dropped it with the slide release.

To reproduce the problem:

1) the slide must be locked on an empty mag

2) trigger must be pulled with slide locked

3) slide must be released using the slide stop, not by racking the slide, because...

4) grip safety must not be pressed while releasing the slide.

If the grip safety is pressed (safety OFF) while releasing the slide after pulling the trigger, the hammer does not follow. If the grip safety is not pressed (safety ON) while releasing the slide, the hammer does follow.

To be fair, the manual does say to slingshot but that can be done without depressing the safety though it is a bit harder to do.

At least one other user with a Gen2 has confirmed he can't duplicate it. I also observed two instances where the trigger released the hammer with the slide out of battery, and one where the trigger just locked up tight and would not move with safety on or of until the slide was racked.

I probably won't be taking this gun to the range today.
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 05, 2016 8:18 am
Well, I'm glad I opted for the 1911R-1 trade instead of waiting for the return of a Gen II R51. I sure didn't want to go through the brain damage again. I'll just stick with my Sig P938 for a back-up to my Sig Ultra 1911. I just can't help trusting my life to Sig Sauer reliability. My Remington 1911R-1 and the Colts are my main ones for fun at the range, but the Sigs are my muscle-memory-pieces. I start my range hours with the Sigs, shoot the others, then finish up my hours with the Sigs again. Then, off to the workbench for cleaning I go! I am, however, still going to watch the R51s and see how they fare the scrutiny and testing. I'll still put my old 1919-built Remington Model 51 up against the R51 any time and it will, as always, run flawlessly. Wish I could find a good Model 53. Just like the 51 but bigger and is .45ACP instead of .380ACP.

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 05, 2016 9:29 am
I got my Gen 2 on Friday (7-1-16). I took it to the range and ran 100 rounds FLAWLESSLY, I then loaded a few mags of high quality reloads and again it ran perfectly. On Saturday the 2nd I went back out and tried some Hornady Critical defense and again it performed without a single hiccup. I have about 200 rounds through it of several brands and have not had one single problem. I took home and cleaned and was pleasantly surprised and how clean it was. Remington over oiled it but other than that I am super pleased.
While I'm not happy with waiting 27 months, in my opinion they have finally made a 9mm that I can feel comfortable using as my EDC.
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 05, 2016 9:50 am
Trackercasey wrote:I got my Gen 2 on Friday (7-1-16). I took it to the range and ran 100 rounds FLAWLESSLY, I then loaded a few mags of high quality reloads and again it ran perfectly. On Saturday the 2nd I went back out and tried some Hornady Critical defense and again it performed without a single hiccup. I have about 200 rounds through it of several brands and have not had one single problem. I took home and cleaned and was pleasantly surprised and how clean it was. Remington over oiled it but other than that I am super pleased.
While I'm not happy with waiting 27 months, in my opinion they have finally made a 9mm that I can feel comfortable using as my EDC.

How's it feel in your hand? I never even got to see a R51 before the recall. Anxiously awaiting the release to get my hands on it!
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 05, 2016 10:11 am
Trackercasey wrote:I got my Gen 2 on Friday (7-1-16). I took it to the range and ran 100 rounds FLAWLESSLY, I then loaded a few mags of high quality reloads and again it ran perfectly. On Saturday the 2nd I went back out and tried some Hornady Critical defense and again it performed without a single hiccup. I have about 200 rounds through it of several brands and have not had one single problem. I took home and cleaned and was pleasantly surprised and how clean it was. Remington over oiled it but other than that I am super pleased.
While I'm not happy with waiting 27 months, in my opinion they have finally made a 9mm that I can feel comfortable using as my EDC.



My Gen 1 ran fine with the right ammo which was strictly Remington and nothing else because the chamber was clearly not finish reamed. I was hoping they would address that in Gen 2 along with the wobbly trigger, the rough cycling of the slide, the pimpled primers, the soft bolt, and the magazine lips. The redesigned disconnector took care of the slide cycling and the new mags seem to feed better. The bolt has been cleaned up and plated but the rest of the issues remain and the erratic performance of the new disconnector has been added.

I'm glad yours is working for you. I'm thinking I should have left well enough alone with my Gen 1. I could have fixed the chamber myself with a finish reamer. Now I'm probably looking at sending the Gen 2 back. Maybe this turnaround will be quicker, but I have totally lost confidence in Remington and there is no way I'd trust anything they send me for an EDC. Except cash. I'll gladly take a refund and cash out.
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 05, 2016 10:47 am
AmericanPride wrote:
Trackercasey wrote:I got my Gen 2 on Friday (7-1-16). I took it to the range and ran 100 rounds FLAWLESSLY, I then loaded a few mags of high quality reloads and again it ran perfectly. On Saturday the 2nd I went back out and tried some Hornady Critical defense and again it performed without a single hiccup. I have about 200 rounds through it of several brands and have not had one single problem. I took home and cleaned and was pleasantly surprised and how clean it was. Remington over oiled it but other than that I am super pleased.
While I'm not happy with waiting 27 months, in my opinion they have finally made a 9mm that I can feel comfortable using as my EDC.

How's it feel in your hand? I never even got to see a R51 before the recall. Anxiously awaiting the release to get my hands on it!



I have very large hands and can get a full grip on the gun, this was one of the selling points for me originally. I love the feel and the with spring around the barrel instead of on a guide pin, the felt recoil is more of a rearward push as opposed to the upward flip of a more traditional design.

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 05, 2016 10:51 am
JRH6856 wrote:
Trackercasey wrote:I got my Gen 2 on Friday (7-1-16). I took it to the range and ran 100 rounds FLAWLESSLY, I then loaded a few mags of high quality reloads and again it ran perfectly. On Saturday the 2nd I went back out and tried some Hornady Critical defense and again it performed without a single hiccup. I have about 200 rounds through it of several brands and have not had one single problem. I took home and cleaned and was pleasantly surprised and how clean it was. Remington over oiled it but other than that I am super pleased.
While I'm not happy with waiting 27 months, in my opinion they have finally made a 9mm that I can feel comfortable using as my EDC.



My Gen 1 ran fine with the right ammo which was strictly Remington and nothing else because the chamber was clearly not finish reamed. I was hoping they would address that in Gen 2 along with the wobbly trigger, the rough cycling of the slide, the pimpled primers, the soft bolt, and the magazine lips. The redesigned disconnector took care of the slide cycling and the new mags seem to feed better. The bolt has been cleaned up and plated but the rest of the issues remain and the erratic performance of the new disconnector has been added.

I'm glad yours is working for you. I'm thinking I should have left well enough alone with my Gen 1. I could have fixed the chamber myself with a finish reamer. Now I'm probably looking at sending the Gen 2 back. Maybe this turnaround will be quicker, but I have totally lost confidence in Remington and there is no way I'd trust anything they send me for an EDC. Except cash. I'll gladly take a refund and cash out.



That sucks that you are dissatisfied, I'm hoping yours is the exception, not the rule. My Gen 1 wouldn't safely fire any ammo, Remington was actually some of the worst through it. I have not tried to duplicate the problem you had, but will be giving it a try this evening. Overall I'm satisfied with the Gen 2 for sure.
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 05, 2016 10:57 am
Trackercasey wrote:That sucks that you are dissatisfied, I'm hoping yours is the exception, not the rule. My Gen 1 wouldn't safely fire any ammo, Remington was actually some of the worst through it. I have not tried to duplicate the problem you had, but will be giving it a try this evening. Overall I'm satisfied with the Gen 2 for sure.


Please post your results. And check to see if your disconnector is held by a roll pin or a solid pin. So far, the two guns that I know have shown problems have solid pins.
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 06, 2016 12:10 am
JRH6856 wrote:
Trackercasey wrote:I got my Gen 2 on Friday (7-1-16). I took it to the range and ran 100 rounds FLAWLESSLY, I then loaded a few mags of high quality reloads and again it ran perfectly. On Saturday the 2nd I went back out and tried some Hornady Critical defense and again it performed without a single hiccup. I have about 200 rounds through it of several brands and have not had one single problem. I took home and cleaned and was pleasantly surprised and how clean it was. Remington over oiled it but other than that I am super pleased.
While I'm not happy with waiting 27 months, in my opinion they have finally made a 9mm that I can feel comfortable using as my EDC.



My Gen 1 ran fine with the right ammo which was strictly Remington and nothing else because the chamber was clearly not finish reamed. I was hoping they would address that in Gen 2 along with the wobbly trigger, the rough cycling of the slide, the pimpled primers, the soft bolt, and the magazine lips. The redesigned disconnector took care of the slide cycling and the new mags seem to feed better. The bolt has been cleaned up and plated but the rest of the issues remain and the erratic performance of the new disconnector has been added.

I'm glad yours is working for you. I'm thinking I should have left well enough alone with my Gen 1. I could have fixed the chamber myself with a finish reamer. Now I'm probably looking at sending the Gen 2 back. Maybe this turnaround will be quicker, but I have totally lost confidence in Remington and there is no way I'd trust anything they send me for an EDC. Except cash. I'll gladly take a refund and cash out.

$100 cash + shipping, right now
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 06, 2016 12:15 am
Trackercasey wrote:
AmericanPride wrote:
Trackercasey wrote:I got my Gen 2 on Friday (7-1-16). I took it to the range and ran 100 rounds FLAWLESSLY, I then loaded a few mags of high quality reloads and again it ran perfectly. On Saturday the 2nd I went back out and tried some Hornady Critical defense and again it performed without a single hiccup. I have about 200 rounds through it of several brands and have not had one single problem. I took home and cleaned and was pleasantly surprised and how clean it was. Remington over oiled it but other than that I am super pleased.
While I'm not happy with waiting 27 months, in my opinion they have finally made a 9mm that I can feel comfortable using as my EDC.

How's it feel in your hand? I never even got to see a R51 before the recall. Anxiously awaiting the release to get my hands on it!



I have very large hands and can get a full grip on the gun, this was one of the selling points for me originally. I love the feel and the with spring around the barrel instead of on a guide pin, the felt recoil is more of a rearward push as opposed to the upward flip of a more traditional design.

I'm very eager to get one. I've wanted one for so long. I've never been this anxious about a gun. I'm more than willing to risk the cheap cost of the gun.

I've got bigger hands too. Hence why both of my carry guns are double stacked 1911's. I like a full grip.

The scuttlebutt is Rem is going to start building double stack 1911's since they absorbed Para USA
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 06, 2016 7:09 am
AmericanPride wrote:$100 cash + shipping, right now


Pass. I've already had better offers. And I've got a new 2 year warranty from Remington. WooHoo!!!
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 06, 2016 7:16 am
AmericanPride wrote:I have very large hands and can get a full grip on the gun, this was one of the selling points for me originally. I love the feel and the with spring around the barrel instead of on a guide pin, the felt recoil is more of a rearward push as opposed to the upward flip of a more traditional design.

I'm very eager to get one. I've wanted one for so long. I've never been this anxious about a gun. I'm more than willing to risk the cheap cost of the gun.

I've got bigger hands too. Hence why both of my carry guns are double stacked 1911's. I like a full grip.

The scuttlebutt is Rem is going to start building double stack 1911's since they absorbed Para USA


Other people with large hands (RyeOnHam is one) have complained about the slide eating the web of their hand. You can see it in his Range Report on the R51 on YouTube.

I don't have large hands. It fits my hands well, front to back, but is not wide enough to fill my hand. The gun that fits my hand best is the Browning High Power The R51 grip panels are dead flat. A custom set with a palm swell would help a lot. That said, the control is excellent. Soft recoil, low muzzle flip and fast recovery, even with +P ammo.
Last edited by JRH6856 on Wed Jul 06, 2016 12:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 06, 2016 12:16 pm
JRH6856 wrote:
AmericanPride wrote:I have very large hands and can get a full grip on the gun, this was one of the selling points for me originally. I love the feel and the with spring around the barrel instead of on a guide pin, the felt recoil is more of a rearward push as opposed to the upward flip of a more traditional design.

I'm very eager to get one. I've wanted one for so long. I've never been this anxious about a gun. I'm more than willing to risk the cheap cost of the gun.

I've got bigger hands too. Hence why both of my carry guns are double stacked 1911's. I like a full grip.

The scuttlebutt is Rem is going to start building double stack 1911's since they absorbed Para USA


Other people with large hands (RyeOnHam is one) have complained about the slide eating the web of their hand. You can see it in his Range Report on the R51 on YouTube.

I don't have large hands. It fits my hands well, front to back, but is not wide enough to fill my hand. The gun that fits my hand best is the Browning High Power The R51 grip panels are dead flat. A custom set with a palm swell would help a lot. That said, the control is excellent. Soft recoil, low muzzle flip and fast recovery, even with +P ammo.


It does occasionally catch the we web on my hand. After 150+- rounds it was a bit tender but it did not break the skin. I might try the bigger grip panels and see if that helps.

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PostPosted: Fri Jul 08, 2016 4:08 pm
II just received my R51 Gen 2 yesterday. Rye on Ham has made several videos on YouTube and I contacted Remington about the items he indicated on his latest "Factory Defects" post. I said I did not want to take it to the range if in fact the pin in mine, that is only ~3/8" long, was the wrong one. Their response to each item I relayed to them that he had indicated on his video is listed below:
1) The ejector pin is the factory pin and is not supposed to extend from wall to wall. The disconnector is not supposed to operate on this pin. The purpose for it is only to retain the ejector, not to interact with the disconnector. (I would recommend each new owner inspect the location of the ejector pin when you take it out of the box to see exactly where it is in relation to the holes on each and take a picture of it. Then check it when you clean it each time to make sure it has not moved. At least you will know where to reposition it if it does move.)
2) the corrections Remington made on the Gen 2 were not due to anything related to the frames, thus the frames already in stock will be used first and the newly stamped frames from the Huntsville, Alabama plant will come out later this year (I assume after the others have all been used from the original inventory).
3) the term galling called out by RoH is defined as something different than what is happening to the block in the RoH Factory Defect video. What is happening is the breech block is made of a softer material than that of the slide, by design, and his has some slight deformation. This was described as being similar to lifter wearing on a camshaft or piston rings wearing in your cars cylinders.
I was appreciative of the responses, but this does not explain the underlying reasons for the questions. If the ejector pin is the correct length and it was performing as designed, why were there ejector issues in the "Range Report" video by Rye on Ham? Is it purely related to the cheap TulAmmo he used? Also, his has some real ejector wear on the frame that should not have happened if the pin was holding it in place properly.
The frames being used from inventory is a business decision and since the corrections that were made were completely resolved with other changes, the original frames were not defective and will be used until they run out. The wear on the breech block is the biggest issue that I take from his video, other than use only American made ammo for the American made pistol. If there is that much "deformation" with less than 1000 rounds, how long will it take until the R51 needs a "ring job". Also, with the continued deformation wear (not galling, as I was told), is there going to be additional problems with the FTE happening more often and closer together until it does not function at all. I went back and looked at his video "Table Report" made when he first received his Gen 2 and if you look closely, the breech block has some major wear on it already. If the video was actually made as he was unboxing it, prior to shooting it, then there was some obvious wear visible from the factory. When I inspected mine right out of the box, there were no irregularities and it looks clean, new, no deformation or bad stamps, with no damage to it to the naked eye.
I suggested the base plates to the magazines be made thicker and extend beneath the grip frame with some of my first recommendations to Remington over two years ago. My first R51 ran great for over 800 rounds with only minor wear on the front top edges of the ejector piece. I sent it back with hopes the Gen 2 would correct that and any of the other items that others were having that had not become apparent yet on mine. It was smooth and fit my hands perfect, was easy to conceal, low recoil, all of the things that it was being hyped for, it was doing on mine! I am happy to have received the Gen 2 and hope it will perform the same as the one I had before. Only one time was there a FTE and FTF when I tried using some cheap Russian steel cased ammo (which I threw away the second half of the box). ALL other American made standard and +P ammo performed flawlessly and there were no issues...none! I sure hope the issues RoH had are strictly related to his R51 and are not a design related issue in the R51 Gen 2 as a whole. I will follow up with another post after my visit to the range. Like most others, I really want this to work like it is supposed to also. I honestly would prefer an all Stainless model, resolving most of these wear issues, even if it is heavier and at a higher cost. Let us know how yours works!

Now an R51 Gen 2 Beta Tester,
ShoT3

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PostPosted: Fri Jul 08, 2016 6:14 pm
Well, if they used old frames how come I couldn't have my old frame back reconditioned? Who now has the frame with the serial number on it that I originally purchased?

It would have been much simpler, and wouldn't have required a FFL, to send me back my original frame.

So, does Remington have a Generation 3 coming out? New frame and other new parts?
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 09, 2016 2:06 pm
RED HORSE wrote:Well, if they used old frames how come I couldn't have my old frame back reconditioned? Who now has the frame with the serial number on it that I originally purchased?

It would have been much simpler, and wouldn't have required a FFL, to send me back my original frame.

So, does Remington have a Generation 3 coming out? New frame and other new parts?


My Gen 2 frame appears to have additional finishing/surface hardening on the frame lug that the bolt locks against. My Gen 1 lug showed wear after handcycling that my Gen 2 does not show after the same amount of cycling. And the Gen 1 lug was worn even more after firing. I suspect that it may not have been possible or cost effective to restore and surface harden the lug on the returned frames.
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 14, 2016 6:19 pm
My R51 story in a nutshell.

Once upon a time I bought a R51 (over two years ago). Had problems with it right away as fore mentioned on here. Called Remington to send it in, no bag/label showed up after a few weeks to return it back to Remington. Called again and waited. In the meantime I went to the gun shop, advised them of the issues and traded it for a S&W Shield (I was really wanting a cc handgun as Illinois had just passed the CCW law). Remingtons return materials finally showed up, but too late. A year later I get a letter from Remington apologizing for the R51 delays, etc. Fast forward to June '16. I get an email from Remington telling me to provide my local FFL info. Emailed the info back to them as requested, and today I get a call from my FFL that my R51 is ready to be picked up. The End.
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 14, 2016 8:48 pm
remmy wrote:My R51 story in a nutshell.

Once upon a time I bought a R51 (over two years ago). Had problems with it right away as fore mentioned on here. Called Remington to send it in, no bag/label showed up after a few weeks to return it back to Remington. Called again and waited. In the meantime I went to the gun shop, advised them of the issues and traded it for a S&W Shield (I was really wanting a cc handgun as Illinois had just passed the CCW law). Remingtons return materials finally showed up, but too late. A year later I get a letter from Remington apologizing for the R51 delays, etc. Fast forward to June '16. I get an email from Remington telling me to provide my local FFL info. Emailed the info back to them as requested, and today I get a call from my FFL that my R51 is ready to be picked up. The End.

So...a free gun and you just end with "the end"?
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.270 WIN
Posts: 177
Joined: Tue Feb 11, 2014 6:54 pm
PostPosted: Thu Jul 14, 2016 9:06 pm
I just stopped in to look at it. Didn't have the cash on me for the transfer fee. Pick up on Monday. I will shoot it as soon as I get it. I have 1k rounds of bulk Winchester, federal and Remington ball ammo I plan to burn through it and see how she holds up.

Yes, Free. Apparently Quality isn't the only thing they are lacking in.
"...to disarm the people - that was the best and most effectual way to enslave them." -George Mason
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